While some cultivators might focus on yield or volume, Malek’s Premium Cannabis is all about passion over profit with a flavor-first approach. And joining us today to explain why is Malek’s CMO and Head of Marketing Katherine Wolf.
Katherine is a self-confessed branding nerd and a published writer with a passion for helping cannabis companies grow and thrive. She advocates for women in cannabis leadership and safe access to cannabis education and products. She has been published in media outlets such as the Northwest Leaf, MJ Brand Insights, and Skunk Magazine.
In our conversation, you’ll learn how Malek’s Premium is always pheno-hunting to create new strains and how sticking to limited runs, and small batches helps cultivate the finest flower. You’ll also hear how they use NFTs in their marketing strategy with the community they’ve built and how they generate a buzz with new strains using social media.
- Why Malek’s Premium Cannabis focuses on small batch cannabis products with limited runs of 8 to 10 lights per strain.
- The sense of community that Malek’s has created and how they generate excitement using customer feedback when selecting the strains for new batch consumption.
- How Malek’s interest in seed breeding became the foundation of their flavor-first guiding philosophy.
- The obstacles that still exist when using social media or Instagram as a marketing tool to push customers to your website.
- How Malek’s uses NFTs in their marketing strategy and as a loyalty reward tool.
- Why Katherine believes destigmatizing cannabis needs to happen before federal legalization.
- “Still to this day our grow team is hunting and choosing genetics and which phenotypes we’re going to run based on quality and taste where a lot of other brands are solely focused on yields or volume.” – Katherine Wolf
- “I think we are just learning what you can say and what you can’t say, working within those constraints and then finding those out-of-the-box ways to tease a new strain on Instagram.” – Katherine Wolf
- Malek’s Premium Cannabis
- Follow Katherine Wolf on LinkedIn
- Follow Malek’s Premium Cannabis on Instagram
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Rick Kiley: All right. Hello, everyone, and welcome to another episode of The Green Repeal. I am Rick Kiley, one of your co-hosts, along with Jeffrey Boedges. We are together today.
Jeffrey Boedges: We are.
Rick Kiley: In the office.
Jeffrey Boedges: The dynamic duo is back together.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. I’m a little weird. I’m doing a little cleanse, a gut cleanse. I’m drinking like shakes and shots. And so, if I freak out at all.
Jeffrey Boedges: Noted, yeah, I don’t do that. I probably need it but it is so much effort…
Rick Kiley: Yeah, you need it. We all need it sometime.
Jeffrey Boedges: You know, my body is a temple, Rick. I put in the best possible illegal substances that you can get.
Rick Kiley: Well, speaking of the best possible quasi-legal substance.
Jeffrey Boedges: No. Fully legal.
Rick Kiley: Fully legal, fully legal substances. We’ll set up our interview. Today, we are welcoming Katherine Wolf. She is a published writer and branding specialist with a passion for helping cannabis companies grow and thrive. Today, she is here as the Chief Marketing and Operations Officer of Malek’s Premium Cannabis, which is a small-batch Colorado cultivator focused on flavor-first genetics. Katherine has a B.S. in Marketing and Economics from the University of Tampa and a background working with B2C and B2B brands focused on tech, hospitality, and manufacturing. In addition to her work at Malek’s Premium, she’s passionate about advocating for women in cannabis leadership and safe access to cannabis education and cannabis products for all. I think you’ll find a supportive audience for that. She is an active member of numerous industry organizations, has been published in media outlets around the country including the Northwest Leaf, MJ Brand Insights, Skunk Magazine. It’s not about the animal.
Jeffrey Boedges: No.
Rick Kiley: No. Could be.
Jeffrey Boedges: I’m from the Midwest, Arkansas.
Rick Kiley: And, of course, Marijuana Venture Magazine.
Rick Kiley: Katherine, welcome to The Green Repeal.
Katherine Wolf: Hello. Thank you so much for having me. I’m happy to be here.
Summary of Katherine Wolf’s path to Malek
Rick Kiley: We are thrilled to have you here. Can you just start off by we read a little bit about your bio here, but tell us a little bit about your journey? What brought you from college life, working life, professional life, and how did you end up being the CMO over here at Malek’s Premium Cannabis?
Katherine Wolf: For sure. So, I have a degree in Marketing Economics from the University of Tampa. I was actually born and raised in Florida. So, I like to say I’m a branding nerd. I would say nothing excites me more than a good brand. And so, I always knew I wanted to study marketing. My dad was an entrepreneur so it’s something that was really personally a passion of mine. And I kind of started my career in agency life, working with a lot of different brands, a lot of different industries. And I definitely knew I was in the right place, in the right field because I love marketing and love branding but I just didn’t have that drive and that passion for the companies and the teams I was working with. Now, I have been a personal cannabis user for a long time. You know, it really changed my life for the better. I think it is such a powerful plan that can be used for so many in so many different ways. And so, as a branding geek, I was always super fascinated by what companies are doing in the space as an emerging industry.
And so, that fascination paired with my personal passion for the planet, I really always knew I wanted to end up in cannabis. Living in Florida at the time, there obviously were not a lot of legal opportunities to do so. So, when the pandemic happened, I took the opportunity and relocated to Denver and joined the marketing department of a national growth supply hydroponics retailer. So, really learned a lot about the industry and got my foot in the door and made some really valuable connections and was reassured I was on the right path doing something in the cannabis industry, but really still had that edge to do more and be hands-on with the plant. And Malek’s Premium Cannabis was my absolute favorite brand at the time. I actually had a budtender, one of the first dispensaries I ever went to when I moved to Denver, make just like such an impactful recommendation. Like, you cannot walk out of this dispensary without trying this brand and fell in love with the product. You know, as I mentioned, I love a good brand and I just absolutely loved what they were doing.
And went to an event, met Malek, met the team. And I actually reached out to him and was like, “Hey, I am in the cannabis marketing. I would love to help you out if you ever need any assistance with branding or marketing things or events.” And it just kind of was the right place at the right time. We continue to meet and collaborate on things and it just was really necessary to bring someone in-house to handle all the marketing and the brand was kind of there and ready to take that step. So, I just honestly put myself out there and it was the right place at the right time like I said. And it is just such a joy to be in this industry. I really learned a lot and it is definitely where I’m meant to be and just excited to be here.
Rick Kiley: That’s great. So, you tried the brand, liked the brand, ran into the owner, and said, “Hey, I want to come work with you,” and then now you’re the head of marketing.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. It’s like those people that decide, “I’m going to start a band.”
Katherine Wolf: That’s exactly it.
Jeffrey Boedges: And I go out to California and a week later I have a recording contract, and then two weeks later I’m on tour. You got the rest of those folks out there who have been trying for like six months, ten years, whatever, to get any kind of break.
Rick Kiley: What a story. What a story.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. You popped one in a bottle.
Rick Kiley: That is amazing. That is amazing. I think more people should try that, though.
Jeffrey Boedges: Well, for sure putting yourself out there and just going I think, I mean, we’ve hired a number of people here at our company that way that have generally tracked us down over the years. Sometimes it can be kind of creepy, but sometimes it can be good. Relationships are so key in businesses.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. I don’t think Katherine was creepy.
Jeffrey Boedges: No. Katherine wasn’t creepy.
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. Not without the expectation.
Jeffrey Boedges: Clearly, you weren’t creepy if you got the job.
Katherine Wolf: Obviously, I guess I wasn’t but I was worried I might be. But that’s honestly my number one piece of advice people ask me all the time in the industry, in general, what is your advice? And it’s you just have to put yourself out there. Everything is based off of connections and relationships and you just have to be willing to go for it.
Jeffrey Boedges: Showing up is half the battle.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. Also, it’s a fine line between creepy and persistent. You know, it’s like where do you know? What’s too many phone calls?
Jeffrey Boedges: I actually think it’s really more about charm and building relationship. You know, charming people aren’t that creepy but if you are not charming, then it’s a little harder, I think. I think you’re more challenged that way.
Story of Malek’s Premium Cannabis Products
Rick Kiley: All right. Well, that’s a really cool story and I’m glad you connected with something you’re passionate about. And that’s something you’re able to make into your career right now. So, that’ll just lead us right into the next question with just the story of Malek. So, what is it about this company that is so great, and maybe just sort of how did it originate? How did it come to be? All those things. Tell us the Malek story.
Katherine Wolf: For sure. So, we are a craft cultivator. We are recreational in Colorado. So, right now we’re in about 50 dispensary locations throughout the state. We are in Denver and have our biggest concentration of stores there. But you can also find us in Boulder, Fort Collins, down in Durango, out in the Aspen, Vail area. We have all of our locations listed on our website but we are a small, tight-knit team. We always say we are a passion-driven brand. I mean, we are really focused on flavor first flower. That is kind of our motto and our guiding philosophy. So, about ten years ago, Malek moved to Colorado specifically to pursue a career in the cannabis industry. He’s from Houston and he kind of got in on the ground floor when the legal industry was just getting started here. So, he worked his way up. He started at a small organic medical grow and became the head of cultivation at one of the largest rock operations at the time. And kind of throughout that whole experience, he really became obsessed with the science behind strains, the seed breeding, and learned how to do that himself and came to enter and win over 20 International Cannabis Cup awards during that time.
So, he really was working hard to create a line of products that he felt was worthy to eventually break off on his own and bring to the consumer market. He really wanted to have control over the quality and just wanted to do something that was really fulfilling to him. He always does it based on passion over profit. And so, in 2019, he acquired the license, and in 2020, we officially began selling as Malek’s Premium Cannabis. And the flower is our focus. We do a prepackaged eighth and then we also have a lineup of different pre-roll products and some new exciting strains and products and collaborations coming out. But that is who we are and what we’re doing.
Jeffrey Boedges: That’s cool. Are you guys vertically integrated or are you just doing the grow in the products?
Katherine Wolf: So, we are a cultivator so, no, we are not vertically integrated, but that is kind of something in the future. We would love to have our own dispensary and our own kind of consumption lounge duo spot. But at the moment, no. You can find us in a variety of retail partners.
Rick Kiley: Right. And so, business is good. You’re growing, I imagine.
Jeffrey Boedges: Pardon the pun.
Katherine Wolf: Definitely, lots of growth. We have some new products coming out. Like I said, we have an extensive lineup of genetics and different rotations that we want and we have a few strains that have kind of been retired for now and some new genetics coming out and some new artist collaborations and things. So, definitely, continuing to move forward and grow with just new and exciting things.
Rick Kiley: Right. And so, I mean, I want to talk about all of it but what I find interesting about reading about the product and about how you’re doing it is it seems that a lot of companies we’ve been talking to so far are sort of like they develop their core strain, their core materials, and they’re looking for consistency, which I think is important right now, especially as the market needs research and needs to understand what is beneficial for you.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. And these are companies they can go back and rely on. No one wants a surprise.
Small Batch Releases
Rick Kiley: But you seem and this is where I’m going to ask my question here, you seem very committed to this idea of like small batches releases that are good for distribution that I’m imagining are coming and going which hopefully create excitement for your customer. And you’ve even just said that some… So, can you talk about that? I hear and read about small batch a lot as a phrase, a word that’s used. So, it’s used in beer, it’s used in spirits. It usually connotes a limited run and some scarcity. Also, I think it implies higher quality but I don’t know if that’s always the case. Is that the same way you guys think about it? It’s limited run, it’s scarcity, etcetera.
Katherine Wolf: Absolutely. So, we typically grow in small batches of 8 to 10 lights per strain, but we’ll often do an R&D run or a smaller run. That could be just 4 to 6 lights per strain so definitely a much smaller number of, I think, people anticipated.
Jeffrey Boedges: What does that equate to, 8 to 10 lights?
Rick Kiley: Yeah. Assume I don’t know what that is in the production process.
Jeffrey Boedges: Because my buddy in college had 8 to 10 lights and he had a whole lot but I’m guessing it’s a different idea generally.
Katherine Wolf: It really depends on the strain and kind of what you were mentioning. We do have this line of kind of this library of genetics and we have a kind of a core set of strains that are run more often than others. So, we definitely have the classics like The Panda Puffs that we’re really known for, that we’re running more often that are kind of more readily available. And then we do have some more of those ones that people are definitely like waiting for and always reaching out and asking when they’re going to come next. We have an award-winning kind of Larry OG, the London Pound Mintz that we do. Those are a couple I can think of that are always what people are asking about. And like I mentioned, we also do new strains or kind of an R&D run. So, we really have that core product and those core strains there. And then we also like to introduce new things and new product lines and kind of have that mix. People can try new things. There are always those customers who are going to want something exciting, something new, or something different to try. And then you’re going to have the people that are loyal to your brand and want that Panda Puffs every time.
So, it really is a balance of the two and the scarcity is definitely there. And we do really rely on the small batch drops to kind of showcase that premium value and that quality. You know, we really do everything by hand with such care and such attention to detail. And I think you can really see that and feel that and taste that and kind of experience that when you try our products or you come out to one of our events and interact with our team. So, really it’s kind of the foundation of the brand, that flavor first, that small batch, that craft really, really hands-on everyone from our team. And I think the reason that that’s sought after and people love that is because you can really experience that in the end product.
Rick Kiley: Okay. But 8 to 10 lights, is a light equate to a plant? Like, I’m just trying to understand how much like volume of marijuana we’re talking about. That’s what I’m trying to understand also.
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. So, it’s lights. So, I’m talking 8 to 10 lights. There are multiple plants under those lights. Some of our batches are 5 to 6 pounds. Some are 2 to 3. Again, really small. And we release only the absolute best as our premium buds and the prepackaged eighths, and then we have other products as well. So, it really depends from strain to strain how much is produced. And again, some we’ll run a whole room of. Some we’ll do kind of more of a smaller test batch. So, it really is always a bit varying.
Rick Kiley: All right. So, I mean, that’s not a lot. I mean, that I imagine would go fast. So, if…
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. I’m curious, though, you said a person calls you and you assist them. Are they looking because of the flavor-forward or they’re like, “Oh, man, I like this one because it really energizes me or this one helps me sleep?” What’s the driving factor for the popularity of these, is it the benefits, besides the fact that they are small batch production?
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. We have a lot of people DMing us on Instagram, messaging us on the website, calling dispensaries and asking for certain strains, definitely. I think it really is a mix of both. Being a brand that’s flavor first is really our focus. I think a lot of it is the flavor. You know, people taste something and they just love it and they want to have it again. And they’re always the people that are effects based. We just had someone reach out, we have a new strain, Fire OG, and someone reached out and said that it was really the only strain that they’ve been able to find that has helped them with their chronic pain, and they just want to keep getting that strain. And that is something that’s obviously super rewarding for us to hear that it’s beyond someone just liking it or enjoying it that it’s really actually helping them. So, we have instances of both.
Jeffrey Boedges: And so, you’re recording all of the feedback and trying to actually use that as future selling tools?
Katherine Wolf: I would say definitely. I think all of that kind of plays into my inspiration when I am marketing the product and speaking about the brand. A lot of it is feedback from our own team and our team smoking a certain strain and giving me feedback on it, a few things that we hear at events that we do. Again, messages from Instagram and people’s comments on, “Oh, I love the strain. It tasted like this.” “Oh, I took this on a hike and it was great and uplifting.” Like there’s so much feedback all around all the time, inspiration from other brands, other industries. So, I definitely do take all the feedback into account, and being a small brand, there really is always usually me, a person on the other end and we really make a point to respond to each and every DM. If someone reaches out and says, “Hey, where is the strain?” Like, I will go look and find all the places that’s fresh and let them know. And we really try to respond to everyone and answer questions and appreciate any and all feedback and love communicating and just talking to people that support our brand.
Rick Kiley: Right. And so, with some cannabis products in other spaces, if they have limited releases, people with the ability will kind of line up ahead of time. Like, are people marking the dates on the calendars? Do you find people showing up and waiting online as soon as it opens?
Jeffrey Boedges: There’s an alcohol more specifically a whiskey producer that does that not far from where you are in Denver. Yeah. It just goes on the one day.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. So, I’m just curious, is that….
Katherine Wolf: Do you know what they’re called?
Rick Kiley: Oh, Stranahan’s whiskey.
Jeffrey Boedges: Shout out to Stranahan’s.
Rick Kiley: They do an annual release called Snowflake and I think it comes out right around December, around December 1st, every year. And people line up they start camping out and really become great ambassadors for the brand. It becomes now like a party. So, I’m just curious if people are really waiting for your marijuana. I know. I saw you post release dates on the website. Are people camping out like we used to wait for Aerosmith tickets in the 70s? I’m dating myself here but you know.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Well, for our loyalists out there, let me tell you how often Rick listens to Aerosmith.
Rick Kiley: Zero. I was just thinking of…
Jeffrey Boedges: You could just throw a Phish out there. Why not?
Rick Kiley: That’s fine. But we don’t wait online anymore. You just keep refreshing Ticketmaster. Once upon a time, you waited.
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. I don’t think there is any camping equipment involved, but I think there are definitely people who are seeking out drops and going the day that they’re delivered that we’re posting about it. We post all of the strains that are dropping that week on Monday on our website and then we’ll post menus kind of throughout the week at dispensaries, at deliveries, and things like that. But we definitely again are having people reach out and ask us where certain strains are, have dispensaries that are seeking out certain strains when we post about them on Instagram and things that we have new genetics. So, that has been something really exciting to see. It’s definitely people waiting for it and getting excited about it.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Are your friends like calling you from around the country and trying to get the inside scoop like they would for Aerosmith tickets, if you happen to be a roadie or ambassador for Aerosmith? Hey, you know, hook a brother up.
Katherine Wolf: Actually, a lot. Unfortunately, a lot of my friends that do not live in the States, so they have not tried the product yet, but they’re actually all coming to Colorado for a trip soon. So, everyone will finally get their Malek’s fix.
Rick Kiley: All your friends who are listening to this podcast, what are you doing? Get to Colorado already, for crying out loud. I do think it’d be a fun event idea, though, if you’re just like set up, folding chairs, and people with hibachi grills, making garlic grilled cheese., and dolling out a word of advice. That’s what they do in the Phish parking lots. You know, while you’re waiting for the account to open, you have that little maybe the police wouldn’t like it if there wasn’t a permit. I don’t know.
Jeffrey Boedges: I think it’s great. Well, they can’t dislike it because it’s legal and doesn’t likely break any regulations but I think it just depends on the behavior of those waiting.
Rick Kiley: Sure. It can be a fun party. Maybe it’s just breakfast. Maybe they’re just doing breakfast burritos on site.
Jeffrey Boedges: It’s our first awkward pitch moment for you, Katherine, where we just say, “Hey, let us know if you’re ready to produce that big party before the next strain comes out.”
Rick Kiley: But I think that’s fun. So, the other thing I want to ask you about is the logo because it’s on your packaging and we’ve said it in the intro and you’ve said it a few times that this idea of flavor first. You say Flavor First, Flavor First everywhere, which leads me to believe, of course, that flavor is not coming in first with some other marijuana companies. Why is flavor so important? And really through the context of someone who’s been around the block a few times, but when seeking cannabis, I don’t always think about flavor first. You know, I think about what I want to have, what kind of high, what kind of buzz I’m getting on, what experiences I’m going to be at. Am I trying to sleep well? Like all those things are…
Jeffrey Boedges: Intakes and impact.
Rick Kiley: So, this idea of flavor, I really think you’re the first company I’ve seen that’s established a conversation about about flavor. And I’m just curious as to why that’s such a concern and perhaps how that’s intended to create value and a better experience for the user.
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. So, Flavor First is our motto and really, like I said, the guiding philosophy of everything we do from start to finish. I’ll take it back to the very beginning. As I mentioned, Malek’s interest in seed breeding and kind of his love for making new seeds, that really came from him learning to pop seeds and loving that but wanting to make entirely new flavors. So, that is really where it came from originally. And so, it’s still to this day our grow team is hunting and choosing genetics and which phenotypes we’re going to run based on quality and taste where a lot of other brands are solely focused on yields or volume. So, we’re growing in those small batches and then kind of continues from there. Once our flower is harvested, it goes through a low and slow cure and that really optimizes the moisture levels of the buds and lets that flavor profile continue to develop. We always say that you can have amazing genetics, you can have an amazing growth cycle, and if you don’t cure the bud properly, it’s really not going to smoke well, not going to taste well, not going to have a good experience. So, the curing is really essential to have that high-quality product.
From there, all of our buds are hand trimmed and the reason that we do that is because hand trimming keeps the majority of the trichomes intact that are knocked off if you’re using machine trimming. And it also allows us to, again, those prepackaged premium eighths really highlight the bud structure of each different strain. Each nug of different strain is going to look different, right? So, finally, the last step of the process is all of our products are packaged by hand to order and they’re actually stored in a temperature, humidity-controlled room until they are delivered. So, really, from the very beginning to us delivering the product to the dispensary, everything that we’re doing is really focused on getting that small batch hands-on flavor of the flower, and that’s really what sets us apart. I think a lot of other companies are pushing out volume but our goal has always been to put something out that is more premium that really elevates the experience. And that is just something that’s super important to us.
Me personally, as a consumer, flavor is something that I always go for. I know what types of strains, what terpene profiles I like. I am a more educated consumer. For some people that may not be there yet, that’s something that we try and educate about, about the different flavor profiles. This cross in the strain, you can taste it in these notes on exhale like we’re really trying to educate so that people can start to put flavor first. And it obviously is effects-based as well and you want to feel a certain way or you might be going for a hike versus going to sleep and obviously you’re going to want something completely different there. But for us, the flavor is really kind of at the core of everything we’re doing. And really one of the main things that we’re trying to educate and just for our team and our story and kind of what we’re doing, it’s really the most important thing for us.
Jeffrey Boedges: Cool. That’s very, very interesting. You mentioned something on the upfront of that. You said something about popping seeds. Did I hear that correctly? Can you discuss that?
Katherine Wolf: Yes.
Jeffrey Boedges: What does that mean? Rick, do you know? Am I the only guy here?
Rick Kiley: Like popcorn not popping into your mouth? I would guess cracking them open. That’s my guess.
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. So, let’s say you buy a pack of seeds and there is ten seeds in there.
Jeffrey Boedges: I did. I bought a lot of them in college. Yeah.
Katherine Wolf: And then you’re pheno hunting of which of those seeds you then would want to run. So, we’re really selecting based off the flavor and that’s something that’s different for every grower. Some may be looking for bag appeal. Some may be looking for what’s going to yield the most. Some may be looking for what tastes and sells the best. So, again, that is our focus and what we are really prioritizing as a brand. So, flavor first.
Jeffrey Boedges: So, the seeds come from a wholesaler and you guys are then using that almost like selecting hops like from a beer producer whether you’re really letting your nose do the walking.
Katherine Wolf: Definitely in the flavor. So, I would say taste, taste and smell, and the experience as well.
Rick Kiley: So, a person can taste the difference by tasting the seed itself?
Katherine Wolf: Oh, no, no. Not tasting the seed. Once the flower is grown.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Got it.
Katherine Wolf: No. Don’t eat seeds.
Jeffrey Boedges: Unless they’re sunflower seeds.
Rick Kiley: Well, I was always told as a kid, if I ate a watermelon sweet, that like a watermelon would grow.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Now, my parents told me that, too, but it didn’t stop me from eating.
Rick Kiley: I did see someone who recently they had inhaled a seed for something, and something had actually started to grow in their lung. And they thought it was a tumor. It’s actually like a little tree.
Jeffrey Boedges: He got a little watermelon?
Rick Kiley: Yeah. A little watermelon.
Jeffrey Boedges: I’m sorry. I don’t want to be the one to tell you this, but you have watermelon.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. So.
Jeffrey Boedges: All right.
Rick Kiley: I’m taking us off track here. That’s usually your job.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah, exactly. And then you guys are really about innovation so maybe you could just give me the basics on how do you create new strains. You know, how are you guys doing that, just in general? You don’t have to give me the recipe. I’m not going to go out and start a company. I just want to know, how do you do that?
Katherine Wolf: You know, that is honestly not really my specialty. You might have to have Malek on the show and ask him that one. I know that, I get it, what he’s looking for is really a unique flavor profile of something that he has not smoked and seen or experienced before. So, that is for him what he’s looking for. Kind of the end result there is a unique flavor of something that he has not seen before.
Jeffrey Boedges: And so, he’s growing like a trial batch and then trying it? Is that basically how it works?
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. So, pheno hunting, as I mentioned, is when you pop all the seeds and you grow them all and they’re all going to be a little bit different, a little bit varying. We number them number one, two, three, four, etcetera, and then you try them all. And that’s where I mentioned some people are looking for certain things. So, what we would select as the pheno that is best for us, what we want to run based on our brand and our goals and what we’re doing might be different than what the grower down the street if they pop the same ten seeds, which one they would pick.
Jeffrey Boedges: All right. So, you guys are awarding one or two or three of them the blue ribbon and then producing them in a little bit, slightly larger batch.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. And I imagine it’s like someone who discovers that chocolate and peanut butter go well together. You’re like, “Oh, this seed has a lot of chocolate. The seed’s got a lot of peanut butter. I want to put the two of them together to make chocolate peanut butter.”
Jeffrey Boedges: Right. Well, yeah, do you guys, do you blend the strains in your pre-rolls?
Rick Kiley: “I might add Reese’s peanut butter cup sort of metaphor.
Jeffrey Boedges: Are you blending strains…
Katherine Wolf: We actually have…
Jeffrey Boedges: Sorry. Go ahead.
Katherine Wolf: We had not do that. So, well, our pre-rolls are one of the strains and we are doing a pre-pack coming out soon. So, there could be something in the future where there’s multiple strains on like a pack but in one pre-roll, they’re strain-specific.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. I also thought you were doing strain-specific edibles, which is also seemingly pretty unique.
Katherine Wolf: Yes. So, we actually collaborate with Dialed In. So, they are an edibles processor. They’re medical and recreational in Colorado, very popular there, honestly, I would say most dispensaries throughout the state, and they actually partner with various cultivators. So, they do not have a grow. They are a processor so they partner with cultivators and do cultivation-specific strains, specific batches. So, that is something where we’re kind of able to get in front of other customers that let’s say maybe wouldn’t smoke a flower or a combustible, but they prefer to consume with edibles. So, that’s something that we don’t make in-house but we can do these kinds of collaborations and kind of get our brand name and our product in front of someone that wouldn’t try us otherwise. And Dialed In is such a great team and they are delicious. If you ever find yourself in Colorado, they are a must-try. They’re so tasty.
Rick Kiley: I think Jeff’s going next week.
Jeffrey Boedges: I’ll be there on Tuesday.
Katherine Wolf: Oh yes. We have a couple of batches out right now. We have one of 12 sacks Panther and that is a mixed batch, I think.
Jeffrey Boedges: Sixty percent of the time, it works every time.
Katherine Wolf: Yes. That one has been honestly a crowd favorite and then we have Ego Panda. That’s our most recent one, which is Ego Checker, one of our newest cuts, and Panda Puffs, one of our classics and I recommend that one if you see it, at that point, give them a try.
Jeffrey Boedges: Have you guys thought about making– I like the idea of a single strain because it sounds like single malt to me, and I just…
Rick Kiley: I think that’s the deal. What I learned recently because I was trying to find an edible that was similar to another edible, and when you get flower, you can see printed on the label, especially depending on the state, but you’ll have percentages of THC, CBD, CBN, you can get this whole sort of makeup of the cannabinoids that are in it. But if you try to determine that off the package of an edible, like a gummy, it’s not defined there. And I think it’s because it’s just like an amalgamation and blend and I think the idea of a single strain edible is great. I’m so glad you guys are doing it.
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. And what you mention in that, they actually have full terpene reports and writeups on their website of every single batch that they do with the top terpenes, kind of a flavor profile, and they actually put the report up there. So, if that is something that you’re looking for, they definitely provide that education and they’ve also done some mixed batches. So, we have ones that are just the Panda Puffs or just the Space City Syrup, for example. And then they will also do kind of a mixed strain batch like that, Ego Panda that is a mix of two and kind of creates a really unique terpene profile in case that has not been created before. And like I said, they taste delicious. So, you’ve got to get your hands on some next week for sure.
Rick Kiley: Well, Jeff, I’ll have to come back with some, do the stop and buy it somewhere.
Jeffrey Boedges: I’ll stop by. I’ll go in your…
Events & Tools for Marketing Strategy
Rick Kiley: We’ll find out, buy that someplace. But we got to keep moving because we haven’t even talked about marketing yet and that’s what I want to get to here. I’m curious about your current approach to marketing cannabis brand given the restrictions that exist. I know you have a strong Instagram presence. And I’ve read an interview where you say you use an omnichannel approach. I’m just curious as to– and really, top level, you don’t need to get into the weeds, but what right now is your recipe for success? Like, what are you finding is the most effective way to engage your target consumers?
Katherine Wolf: For sure. I think Instagram is obviously important. I hear a lot of people saying, Instagram’s kind of dead in cannabis or that it’s not a channel or brand should focus on or even have an Instagram page because of those restrictions. I personally think it’s crucial to have that social presence.
When I buy a new pack at the dispensary or even not in cannabis, I see something cool or someone talking about a brand, the first thing I do is look up their Instagram. So, I think having that presence and having a clear, cohesive brand on your Instagram page and a good following, it just legitimizes the brand and gives people a platform to really communicate with you. And I think, again, it is so important because it’s one of the few places of the cannabis brand that you can really have that one-on-one interaction. If someone DMing you or responding to your story, it’s honestly probably the place that I have the most conversations with our customers.
I also think the key really there is with the omnichannel approach, you have to push people from your Instagram to your other channels. I think that’s really the key to success. So, for example, teasing a new strain in a way that’s compliant on Instagram and then drive them to your website page where you can talk about the product in whatever terms you want because that’s an own channel or posting event flyers on your socials and then you have those conversations in person. So, you really have that omnichannel approach and not put all your eggs in one basket. Social is just one piece of it.
I always say I feel important to leverage own channels and your marketing strategy, which is where you can control what you say and have ownership over your own data. So, your website, your packaging design, when you’re doing retail pop-ups, your in-store displays, all of those things that you have complete control over. So, again, it’s really a mix of media, your weed maps, and your Leafly menu, your table when you’re doing events, your social media page, your website page. So, all of these things really are crucial, and I think all kind of work off of each other and feed into each other and drive people between each other.
So, again, the social is obviously crucial. The website has been something I’ve been really focusing on lately because, again, it’s really a place where you can say words that would flag on Instagram and post images that would be taken down on Instagram and just get full cosmetic profiles really lead into the education, post about what dispensaries carry your product and where you’re doing events that just allows you to control the narrative and own your own data and be able to really see and access what pages people are on, what things they’re clicking on, what pages they’re on the longest.
And then events are another crucial thing for us because a lot of cannabis community is very tight-knit and there’s always a lot going on. So, between doing kind of retail pop-ups, educational networking events, or just kind of those industry gatherings and parties that are just kind of about all getting together and having a good time, that is another way that we really get a lot of great feedback and really more qualitative in that sense but really, really bite on in the last of this what people are saying about the brand, coming up to the table and getting excited, or what is this thing saying? Like there are a lot of insights and feedback that you can get from those more organic interactions and it doesn’t necessarily always have to be a hard data point to be valuable.
Rick Kiley: Got it.
Jeffrey Boedges: Right. Are social channels becoming more permissive than they were a year ago or two years ago? And this is something we’ve been talking about for a while. I got to feel like eventually, like that worm is going to turn a little. Have you seen anything like that at all, Katherine?
Katherine Wolf: I think what it is, is that the cannabis marketers and brands that are doing it are getting a little bit smarter about how they’re doing it. It’s definitely been a learning curve of what words or what types of images are you getting flagged for or are you seeing other people post, like oh, this post is taken down. I think we are just learning what you can say and what you can’t say and kind of working within those constraints and then finding those kind of out-of-the-box ways to, okay, I’m going to kind of tease a new strain on my Instagram and maybe I can’t say all the words I want to because they are kind of cannabis words that are a trigger, but I’m going to drive the link to the website where I can have a two-paragraph cosmetic profile and pictures and say whatever I want. So, you kind of just have to, I think, pair it with other channels to really see the success. And obviously, the goal would be that eventually, yes, we are able to showcase what we’re doing as a legal brand without a problem, but maybe one day.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah, well, that’s what the whole show is about. What should we do one day?
Katherine Wolf: Yes, it’s very frustrating when you’re doing something legally and other brands that are operating in that state legally are able to showcase whatever they’re doing. And we’re not, but…
Jeffrey Boedges: And you’ve got people down there saying whatever they want to say without any kind of fact-checking at all and or concerns of presenting it as truth, but then they’re going to take down weed companies. That’s maddening.
Rick Kiley: But I mean, I think no matter what, even as legalization comes to be, there are still going to be restrictions, and part of the reason we operate and in the business that we’re in, work a lot with alcohol beverage, but an understanding of compliance and how to communicate in a way that’s legal, that’s always going to be a conversation. Now, hopefully, it’ll be a little less subjective than what somebody an algorithm on Instagram decides to pick up and shut down. And I get that. That’s got to be so frustrating.
But we do know one of the places that you can play, of course, is an act of the world of events. And then you mentioned them and I saw that you’ve done a lot of them. And I wonder if you could talk a little bit more. We are experiential people, so we love to talk about this stuff. I’m curious, two things, first, just when you manage events, are you finding yourself doing more for trade advocacy or consumers? Where do you find yourself spending more time these days?
Katherine Wolf: I would say these days, kind of on the consumer side. We usually do a weekly pop-up at one of our retail partners. We do events that are consumption events that are open to the public. We also do a lot of events that are more industry-focused that might be for budtenders and brands or for badge employees. So, there is really a mix of both. I think both are equally important.
It’s really crucial to just get out in the community and collaborate with other brands and see what other brands are doing and kind of get inspiration. And just, again, I’ll be together kind of working toward those goals of just legalization and education about cannabis and access to cannabis. And then there are the ones that are obviously, more with the focus of driving sales or driving people to one of the dispensaries that we’re in. So, again, both are an important part of the equation and I really enjoy doing both. And we do a lot of things in both arenas.
Rick Kiley: Got it.
Jeffrey Boedges: So, what happens? Let’s say you go to one of your dispensaries. What are you guys doing for the pop-up? Is it like come on in and get a pre-roll? Or is it come on in and try a pre-roll, and it’s all kind of like we’re all hanging out? What’s happening at these things?
Katherine Wolf: So, a dispensary pop-up would be us. You walk in the dispensary, you obviously show your ID and everything. You come in, and we have our bright pink table and we have photos of our products and display packaging. And we have stickers and pens and these little slide items you can take. Our team is there. You can ask questions out of the strains that you have here today, like, what do you recommend, those types of things? It really is more of like a meet and greet and educational thing, people that are walking by or like, hey, have you tried Malek’s before?
Now, a lot of it is getting in front of new people that maybe have never seen or heard of us before. We do have those people that come to kind of pop-ups we see all the time or coming out for the pop-up. We do offer different promotions and limited-time pricing deals and stuff during the pop-up hours. And so, that is something that is really focused obviously on driving foot traffic to our dispensary retail partners, getting fans of the brand to come out and support that drop, getting in front of new people.
And then the industry events are really more for networking and community. And then there are those events where you can have consumption and all hang out and enjoy the product together at a dispensary, that is not something that’s happening there. That is more just kind of getting our brand in front of people when they’re going in the shop.
Jeffrey Boedges: Cool. And how are you guys using promoting those? Is that all through social, saying, hey, come on down to this dispensary? Are they doing it to their constituency?
Katherine Wolf: So, we always will make graphics and promote events and pop-ups that we’re having on our Instagram stories. We also have an event page on our website that list all the events and things that we have scheduled and coming up. A lot of times, the dispensary partners will make their own graphics and share about it as well, add us on their website, their vendor day calendars. And then we share the things that we post and we share what they post and vice versa.
So, definitely, the goal for everyone is obviously to drive foot traffic into that dispensary and drive sales and just get our brand in front of them. So, we’re really trying to show our value and help and support the dispensary by driving people in, specifically to come get a Malek’s product. And that is something that we’re really measuring the success of those retail pop-ups by how many units were sold during those pop-up hours, that the dispensary put in another order after the pop-up with our team really excited to see us when we got there, those are all of the things that we’re really kind of looking for with our retail pop-up, whereas I know that and the community and maybe more of just being there and being a part of it. And there’s not necessarily anything directly tied to that.
Rick Kiley: Got it. Can you give us an example of one of those experiences, something that’s not– I think I am pretty clear on what a retail pop-up kind of can do and does, but what are some other events that are community involvement?
Jeffrey Boedges: I want to go to the one where you get to hang out and enjoy a spliff with a bunch of friends. That’s the one I want to go.
Rick Kiley: You got that one, spliff fest?
Katherine Wolf: Yeah, I would say kind of our biggest event of the year has always been our 710 party and Battle for the Rosin Strap. So, we actually just have that.
Rick Kiley: Sorry, Battle for the Rosin Straps?
Katherine Wolf: The Battle for the Rosin Strap, yes. So, it is actually a competition. Colorado’s, a top concentrate brand, submitted a blind entry that was judged by members of our team and kind of other top industry players. Everyone comes out on the actual 710. It’s kind of a big party. We had live music and food trucks and things like that. And then we announced at 7:10 p.m. who won the Rosin Strap. Soiku Bano won it the first year. This one was our second annual DabLogic along with their Hazelnut Cream. And that has just been an event that everyone waits for all year and loves and other brands and people in the public come out to support.
And we’re actually doing one this year with flower. So, we’re having our Croptober first annual on October 1st this year in Denver, and we have some of the top flower companies in the state submitting, again, entries that we’ll be judging and announcing a winner. So, that is kind of more of like a fun event that we do at Marijuana Mansion, something that we don’t host, to kind of give you an example of that, that is kind of a cannabis-themed experiential museum, if you will, and kind of hang-out spot in Denver. They will host industry nights that invite people from different brands like budtenders, cultivators, all different kinds of people in the cannabis space just kind of come and hang out and walk around the activation and have their products and consume. And so, those are just kind of some examples of the different kind of events.
Jeffrey Boedges: In Colorado, that’s legal to have onsite consumption like that?
Katherine Wolf: Yes, at private places. I mean, everyone is 21 up. So, a lot of these events is like an RSVP you do ahead of time and you have to have a QR code or ticket, and then they ID you at the door.
Rick Kiley: Got it.
Jeffrey Boedges: Cool.
Rick Kiley: Cool. All right. And so, like the Marijuana Mansion is something you are a sponsor of, I’m using that loosely, but you come and you bring your wares and you participate in. And the other ones are things that you’re producing and hosting yourself.
Katherine Wolf: Yep. So, there are definitely things that we host and put on. There are things that multiple brands are doing we’re a part of and we’re a sponsor or just maybe one of a few hosts. And then there are things that are due to kind of goes and attends. I mean, we just kind of like to go and support industry events and other brands in the community and kind of show our team.
Rick Kiley: Great. And so, for those, I feel like probably the retail pop-ups, it’s probably a little bit easier to gauge to what degree they’re successful because you’ll have in-store sales, brand ambassadors, and that sort of thing, probably capture names and add them to your database.
Katherine Wolf: Definitely.
Rick Kiley: How do you evaluate whether or not these other programs that you’re talking about, these’d be participating at Marijuana Mansion or one of your own events, how do you judge whether what degree they’re successful?
Jeffrey Boedges: Like using e-com coupons?
Katherine Wolf: No, I think I got it really kind of that mix of qualitative and quantitative data. Sometimes, you’re not going to get a number from an event or again, tie it to something in particular, but I think it’s almost just like a feeling. I think you can kind of tell if you made valuable connections. Again, people coming up to us and giving us feedback about the brand or asking a question or like, oh, we’re so excited to see you there. People sharing pictures on social media during and after, and that gives us content to reshare.
And so, there are a lot of ways that we kind of judge. I think we’ve been in the space for a little bit. We collaborate with a lot of other brands in the state and have really good partnerships. So, I think we have a really good idea at this point of kind of the types of events that we want to be at and brands that we go and support their events and vice versa. I mean, it’s really, like I mentioned, Colorado has such a tight-knit cannabis community and there’s always so much going on and so many brands working together and just driving inspiration from each other, and again, kind of supporting the industry as a whole. It’s super important to not forget, even though we’re kind of all in the same space, we’re all working towards the same goal.
Rick Kiley: That’s great. That’s awesome.
Jeffrey Boedges: So, who’s going to these events? Is it you? Is it Malek? Who’s going? Who’s representing the brand when you’re going to these things?
Katherine Wolf: Malek is at most of the events, some are pop-ups. It really is dependent. We have some people on the team that do different pop-ups. Our team goes as much as we can. We’re a small team, so we really try and go out and all kind of support and hang out and do what we can. You will definitely find different members of the Malek’s team around different events for sure, but we all are involved and all go out and support.
Rick Kiley: Cool. We’re starting to come towards the end of our time. I want to make sure I asked about this one thing I read. I read that you used an NFT reward system to help market your wares. And I’m curious as to, if you could explain what that was, how that worked, and did it work? Was it successful?
Jeffrey Boedges: I got a new one for us, guys. Nonfungible token.
Rick Kiley: Nonfungible token.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah.
Katherine Wolf: That’s good.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. If the token is fungible, it’s not memorable. Really. It needs to be more memorable. It definitely wasn’t flavor first. It was flavorless.
Jeffrey Boedges: Oh, man. Whoa.
Rick Kiley: Sorry, I tell you I’m just drinking shakes all day.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah.
Rick Kiley: All right.
Jeffrey Boedges: It’s late in the afternoon.
Katherine Wolf: You’re hungry?
Rick Kiley: No, it’s all good.
Katherine Wolf: Yes. But let’s talk about the NFTs. So, we’re the first Colorado cannabis brand to kind of use this technology as a marketing tool. So, I really like to think of them as a digital baseball card. So, what we do is we have our own branded Malek’s wallet. So, you’ll come out to one of our events. We have our pink table there, we’re easy to find. And we have a QR code on the table. So, you scan the QR code, you just sign up with a username and password. It’s very easy.
And then you have your Malek’s wallet. So, whenever you come to future events, you see in that event’s QR code. You log into your wallet and then you will get that event, limited edition NFT. Every event has a unique design, and your NFT is minted with your token number and the time and the date. So, really, at first, what this was, was a way to get people to come out to our pop-ups and again kind of drive out foot traffic, show our value to our retail partners, and to have another kind of cool thing to do with our consumers, though. Like I mentioned, if we had like a certain screen, drop at that pop-up, the graphic would be maybe about that strain or if there was like a starting collaboration dropping.
We did a summer series where they were all kind of really bright and summer themed. So, really, the consumer is able to go and kind of collect and have this, they pull up their Malek’s wallet and you can just go and see all the designs and all the events you do and your kind of collection. And then from there, we’ve really got this community where now, we’re starting to host things and invite our NFT holders, two things with their wallet so we can actually put an NFT with exclusive event details in an NFT holder’s wallet, and so, kind of send out a blast like, hey, check your wallet and there’s kind of a secret surprise in there with a date and time to a sesh or an event that nobody else is invited to.
So, this really kind of gives us an opportunity to bridge that gap between traditional marketing and the digital space with actually meeting in the physical space. And what’s really cool is it kind of allows us to reward the people that are really, really supporting our brand and coming out for multiple events and pop-ups, waiting for drops. So, it is something that has been kind of exciting to see the use cases develop, and I think they’re continuing to develop and change as the technology does. And it’s really cool that there’s no gas, that there’s no crypto involved, that people can kind of get their feet wet in the space and get an NFT and kind of experience it and not have to have crypto and kind of deal with all of that situation.
So, it’s really kind of more of a loyalty and rewards tool. I mean, we just had an event and stuff that we did where we sent the invite in the wallet, and it’s just kind of something really interesting and cool that we’re doing that I think is different and unique and gotten some like good feedback on.
Rick Kiley: That’s cool. I mean, it sounds like an interesting evolution of the CRM programs that we’ve all.
Jeffrey Boedges: And the evolution of the NFTs, I mean, I think…
Rick Kiley: That’s cool.
Jeffrey Boedges: This one actually seems quite approachable as to some of the NFT stuff which I’ve seen, which is a little bit hoity.
Rick Kiley: Well, it sounded to me, like someone talked about how like doing ticket stubs to concerts as an NFT would be a good idea. It’s like unique idea over there, maybe you could get like a download of the live concert, that sort of thing. And the way you’re describing it, it’s reminding me of that. You were a participant in this or you tried this strain or you did this thing. And we know when we have that action recorded, and you’re compelling people to give you the proof of their engagements with the brand, which, of course, when you understand their engagements more, it gives you more data to play with so that’s cool.
Jeffrey Boedges: And it’s a proof that they did, but it’s also for them, it’s a proof to their friends that they did.
Rick Kiley: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Jeffrey Boedges: I think that the social currency is a big part of it and saying, you heard about that? They only made 3 pounds of, yeah, I had some, which is fantastic.
Rick Kiley: Yeah, exactly.
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. And you have to be at that event to scan that QR code and if you weren’t there, there’s like no way you can get it. You can’t share it or give it to somebody else from your wallet. So, it is something really cool that you can just kind of showcase.
Rick Kiley: You can’t resell your NFT or you can’t trade it?
Katherine Wolf: No, you have to be there and you have to have scanned that QR code. So, let’s say there’s three pop-ups this week and they all had NFTs and you went to one of them, like you can’t get those other two. So, it is something that drives people to multiple pop-ups and they keep coming out and supporting to get a different design. And so, I think it’s something that’s really fun.
Rick Kiley: If there’s something you can’t bypass by buying it, like you have to do it, I’m a fan.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah, that’s the social currency.
Rick Kiley: I like it. I like it. That’s really cool. You’re continuing to use it, I would imagine?
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. So, we did our summer series that kind of culminated in the end of summer, a secret event that people were invited to. And we’re kind of continuing to brainstorm and develop different ways that it can be used. And it’s something that, as you mentioned, I think it’s always changing and growing and people are using it in so many different ways. And I love the way that we have chosen to go with it. And I think there’s a lot of opportunities that haven’t been tapped yet. So, we’ll see what happens. But it is something we’re kind of continuing to see where it goes.
Rick Kiley: Awesome, awesome.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah, that’s a great idea.
Rick Kiley: Cool. So, what’s on the horizon? What’s next for you guys?
Katherine Wolf: No, we’re really just kind of focused on crushing the Colorado market. We have some new genetics and products and collaborations coming out. I think a lot more live events in the future is going to be something that we’re really focusing on, eventually, culminating, hopefully at a consumption lounge and dispensary. That would be bright pink building. So, I think expanding into other states and being a nationwide and eventually a global brand is the ultimate goal for us. But we’re really just focused on doing what we do and crushing it right now in Colorado.
Rick Kiley: Yeah, that’s great. That’s great. Well, we wish you the best of luck. If people want to get their hands on your wares, should they come to Colorado or want learn more about the brand, how should they?
Jeffrey Boedges: How should they find you?
Rick Kiley: How should they get the info?
Katherine Wolf: Yeah. Our website is MaleksPremiumCannabis.com. We have all of our events, strain drops, dispensary partners on there. Our Instagram is linked down there as well. It’s maleks_premium_cannabis and DM us. Send a message on the website if you have any questions or are looking for something in particular, I would be more than happy to help you out and help you find what you need.
Rick Kiley: Yeah, and Malek is M-A-L-E-K for those of you who might be new to the name, but it’s awesome. Really pleasure talking to you. We do close out our interviews usually the same way. We are always talking about when cannabis will be legal in the US and just curious if you have a prognostication you’d like to share with the listening audience.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. And what will the record for the Broncos be this year, if you could go ahead and share that, too?
Rick Kiley: I think, how about this? Will cannabis be legal before the Broncos win another Super Bowl?
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah.
Katherine Wolf: Yes. I’m going to go from that one. I’m from Tampa. That’s funny. Yes, but I think, unfortunately, there’s still ways to go. I think the Broncos are going to bring it home before we do. I think before we can expect legalization, we really need to work on this invitation.
As a professional working in this industry, getting out every day and doing something that people are in prison for, I think it’s really our responsibility to kind of continue advocating for those without a voice on the matter. The fact that people can get fired from jobs, even in states where cannabis is legal for testing positive on a drug test, that there are parents who are judged for using cannabis when leaving their kids with a babysitter and going to the bars is like so totally normal.
Like all of these things, I think there is a lot of work that still needs to be done to just change the perception around cannabis, something that’s more positive. And hopefully, within the next, I say like five years, I really think maybe like five to eight, five to ten, obviously, I hope that it’s being, but I think there is just a lot of more work that needs to be done. And I can’t wait for the day and…
Rick Kiley: It’s going to be quite the party.
Katherine Wolf: Come on, Broncos. Yeah, maybe it’ll be the same year, so.
Rick Kiley: Oh, right. It’ll be the day that the Broncos win the Super Bowl.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah.
Rick Kiley: That’ll be the biggest party in all of Colorado. But anyway, all right, Katherine, so great to talk to you today. I hope we get to get out to Colorado and see you at some point.
Jeffrey Boedges: I will be out there next week for real. So, when this thing drops, I’ll probably actually be…
Rick Kiley: Have been there.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah, maybe I’ve already been there, but I’m definitely going to pick up some of your brand, and hopefully, find a t-shirt someplace there.
Rick Kiley: There you go.
Katherine Wolf: Yes. Let me know where you’re at and I’ll let you know what’s close to you.
Rick Kiley: Thanks so much for talking to us today, Katherine. Cheers.
Katherine Wolf: Thank you so much.