In the age of social media backlash and deep distrust in “influencers,” how can one be a responsible ambassador and advocate for cannabis?
Here to help us answer that question is Brooke Burgstahler. She’s a writer, producer, host, and actress in TV, online media, and film. She’s the star of BigMike and Advanced Nutrients’ show, Marijuana Morning News, which she hosts daily. She conceptualizes and shares stories covering everything from pop culture to politics, history, and social justice reform.
Her work has reached millions of viewers, and she’s also a 500-hour certified yoga instructor. Her latest venture is Budding Mind, a cannabis and wellness startup designed to expand the mind and heart through the exploration of plant medicine, alternative healing, science, and spirituality.
Today, Brooke joins the podcast to share the story of how she became a cannabis content creator, showcasing the “softer side” of what can be a grungy and male-dominated industry, and the amazing ways she’s building a singular brand in the space.
- Why Brooke identifies as an authenticator in the cannabis space and not an influencer.
- The similarities between cannabis edutainment and yoga – and what Brooke is doing to create inviting spaces to learn and have fun at the same time.
- How Brooke is using Instagram to responsibly share accurate, vetted information with her audience while avoiding takedowns.
- Why it’s so difficult for cannabis brands to share content on TikTok.
- The common myths around cannabis that Brooke is on a mission to debunk.
- How cannabis does (and doesn’t) fit into a wellness and self-care regimen.
- The unique intersection between cannabis and yoga.
“There’s a lot of greenwashing when it comes to cannabis content as well. Everything is perfect and peachy, and that’s simply not the case because there is no one prescription for all human beings everywhere.” – Brooke Burgstahler
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Rick Kiley: Hello, everyone, and welcome back to another episode of The Green Repeal. I am Rick Kiley, one of your co-hosts, and of course, I’m joined by Jeffrey Boedges out in Jersey. Is it warming up in Jersey yet?
Jeffrey Boedges: It is warming up. Things are starting to melt. I think I actually can see a couple of trees. It’s nice.
Rick Kiley: Nice.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah.
Rick Kiley: Nice. As you like to say, the green shoots are poking up. Spring is on the way.
Jeffrey Boedges: They’re still brown but they’re poking out.
Rick Kiley: Great. Cool. We are excited for our guest today. We are joined by Brooke Burgstahler. She is a writer, producer, host, and actress in television, online media, and film. She’s the star of BigMike and Advanced Nutrients show, Marijuana Morning News, which she develops, produces, and hosts daily. And as an in-demand creator in the cannabis space, Brooke conceptualizes, shares stories, covering everything from pop culture to politics, history, and social justice reform, something we’ve spoken about a lot. Today, Brooke’s online content has reached millions of viewers. I love saying the word millions. Good stuff. If that’s not enough, she has numerous acting credits, a few awards. She’s also a 500-hour certified yoga instructor. I know you and Jeff are going to talk about that. Woohoo! Most recently, Brooke launched a cannabis and wellness startup, Budding Mind, which is designed to expand the mind and heart through the exploration of plant medicine, alternative healing, science, and spirituality.
Rick Kiley: Hello, Brooke, and welcome to The Green Repeal.
Brooke Burgstahler: Aloha. Quite an introduction. Thank you.
Rick Kiley: We try to get it all in there. We want everyone to feel good.
Jeffrey Boedges: We used to work for like professional wrestling so we’re kind of used to the big intro.
Brooke Burgstahler: Who’s going to be holding up the scorecard girls? I want a couple of those.
Jeffrey Boedges: That’s me. That’s me.
Rick Kiley: Yeah.
Brooke Burgstahler: Okay. Oh, interesting outfit, Jeff. I like that.
Rick Kiley: That’s why we’re on the radio.
Jeffrey Boedges: People don’t get to see it but trust me, if you could, you’d probably gouge your own eyes out.
Rick Kiley: So, Brooke, you do appear to be quite the Renaissance woman here. I’m wondering, is there anything, I didn’t mention in that intro that you want to make sure people know about you before we jump in.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yes, absolutely. There’s something very important. I would love to add future dog mom to the mix
Rick Kiley: Oh, sweet.
Jeffrey Boedges: Oh, wow.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah, not to get too far off-topic. Just want to throw that out into the universe.
Rick Kiley: Pandemic puppy adopter? Is that what’s happening here?
Brooke Burgstahler: Precisely. I’m trying so hard to do it on my own.
Rick Kiley: All right.
Jeffrey Boedges: You are precisely a pandemic puppy adopter. That’s a lot of Ps.
Brooke Burgstahler: Parent.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Parent, right.
Rick Kiley: We’re going to use that as one of our warm-ups before we record this thing. Pandemic puppy parent. Pandemic puppy parent.
Brooke Burgstahler: There we go. Inspired.
Rick Kiley: Cool. That’s exciting. I know a lot of people have done that with mixed results, by the way. There are a few people who were having a little bit of like, “Oh, what did I get myself into?”
Brooke Burgstahler: Of course, but I prefer not to do any research and just dive headfirst and to get…
Jeffrey Boedges: There you go.
Rick Kiley: They all said fail fast. Yeah. It’s what we always say. Cool. So, then let’s jump in. Let’s talk about how you got involved in the industry. Would you mind just sharing us a little bit about your journey to becoming a professional in this world of cannabis?
Brooke Burgstahler: Certainly. Well, it all started with my personal experience using cannabis and having absolute adoration for this plant. Moving to Los Angeles after college, I entered into the entertainment industry as an actress and comedian, things I still dabble in. And never did I think that I would be able to have a career in cannabis. Adult-use went legal here, and the whole lid just got popped off of possibilities for me and I started working with Merry Jane, just by happenstance, which is Snoop Dogg’s media company. I started doing Merry Jane News, cannabis reporting for them, which is hysterical. I went to college for broadcast journalism, and I was like, “I’m going to torch my degrees. I’m never going to use that history.” And wouldn’t you know? It’s all come full circle. Thanks. My parents are probably pretty grateful for that. So, yeah, I started working with Merry Jane, told a lot of really incredible stories about cannabis baking, made a docu-series with them called Prisoners of Prohibition about people serving life sentences for cannabis, and then just kind of everything spiraled from there worked with civilized and now with BigMike’s Advanced Nutrients team. So, really a cannabis content creator.
Rick Kiley: Cannabis content creator. Okay. Because I think I have a question here. Someone might refer to you as an influencer. And as people come from marketing, I think you hear the word influencer and you think certain things. Someone who’s got millions of views on YouTube sometimes may be referred to as an influencer. Do you ever refer to yourself that way as a cannabis influencer or is that not a label that you like or what do you think?
Brooke Burgstahler: I think sometimes that word has like a derogatory connotation at this point. I like to think of myself more as an authenticator.
Rick Kiley: Oh, I like that.
Brooke Burgstahler: Isn’t that cute? Yeah. Write that one down.
Rick Kiley: I’m writing it. I’m making something else here.
Brooke Burgstahler: I see you with a pen. So, yeah, my mission is to always stay humble. I’m appreciative of any audience that is interested in my creative efforts and endeavors. And when it comes to showcasing or working with or spotlighting cannabis brands, my objective is always just to authentically share brands and companies that align with me. Because I want people whoever’s following me, whether it be the canna-curious, someone new to cannabis, someone who’s interested in trying a new modality of cannabis, I want everyone to have the best experience possible. So, in order to do that, I have to make sure that I am actually conveying genuine messaging and aligning myself with things that feel right.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. No, that’s great.
Brooke Burgstahler: So, that was quite a workaround with your question.
Rick Kiley: No. Well, I think it’s interesting that the term influencer has even in your mind a bit of a derogatory connotation. I think like some…
Jeffrey Boedges: Social media, in general, is just taking a bath the last 12 months and so anything that sort of like smacks of it I think kind of creates a little bit of a, like you said, a slight negative taste in some people’s mouth.
Rick Kiley: I think you’re getting at a good point, though. I think the negative association with influencer is a perceived lack of authenticity. And I think we’ll have that authentic relationship to what they’re talking about. That doesn’t come across. I think it’s when that phoniness creeps in that we really have a problem. So, I like what you’re talking about here.
Brooke Burgstahler: Right. Like, no, Gummy Bear Hair Vitamins for me. You know what I mean?
Jeffrey Boedges: Is that a thing?
Rick Kiley: Is that a thing?
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh my gosh, that’s like the Skinny Bunny Tea, a lot of influencers. This is like the cliche influencer brand representation. They’d like Skinny Bunny Tea. They’ll sell that or like these gummies that make your hair grow. I don’t think they do any of these things but, oh, you guys haven’t heard of this? Okay. So, that’s what I associate with influencers.
Jeffrey Boedges: Clearly, we don’t need it. Our hair is flowing.
Rick Kiley: Our hair is lush.
Brooke Burgstahler: It’s lush. But those of you listening, we’ve had some lush skulls.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. We’ve got some cool heads of hair. You know, out in the northeast where it’s mostly, I mean, New Jersey kind of come on the market soon but it’s mostly medical practice out here. There’s not a lot of brightly colored gummies. It’s all very patient-focused, patient-oriented. Now, I’m curious. You kind of said something about your mom and dad and I wasn’t thinking what that says but like what do mom and dad think about this lifestyle? Like, you mentioned like you sure you were doing them proud. Is it something that you’re like open and talk with them about, they’re like, “That’s great. I’m really excited.” Are you keeping it a little…
Brooke Burgstahler: On the DL?
Rick Kiley: Not on a DL but a little subdued perhaps.
Brooke Burgstahler: Cat’s out the bag at this point. When I first came to Los Angeles and started working in cannabis, when I first started working with Merry Jane, doesn’t it sound so cool? I’m making weed news with Snoop Dogg like hell, yeah. And I didn’t tell anyone. I didn’t tell my parents. I had a lot of shame around it. I was really fearful that it would jeopardize other opportunities for me. It had much more taboo even just a few years ago. So, my parents were generally not accepting of me being involved in the cannabis space at all. And that required or kind of gave me the perspective that I’m actually appreciative of, to approach my cannabis content with don’t smoke weed on camera or like you can but be mindful, don’t rip dabs on camera. Just try to portray a positive stoner image as much as possible so that people like my parents will be receptive to whatever I’m talking about. But that was then. My mom was, oh, she was the anti-weed gal. Let me tell you. Now she’s like, “Can you send me more Kiva beans? Mama’s running low.”
Jeffrey Boedges: That’s quite a turn.
Brooke Burgstahler: I mean, my mom is like ripping the pipe when I visit for Christmas. She is smoking from, by the way, she makes aluminum foil pipes.
Jeffrey Boedges: Wow. That’s old school.
Brooke Burgstahler: And also, probably I have to assume really bad for you to just heat up aluminum foil and inhale whatever those fumes are. So, I buy her new devices all the time. I just bought her a very pretty, have you heard of My Bud Vase?
Rick Kiley: Yes, I saw that.
Brooke Burgstahler: They’re gorgeous. They’re gorgeous and they’re meant to look like art pieces when you’re not using them as bongs. So, I buy my mom all these like very beautiful pieces to keep her as healthy as possible and as classy as possible and she’s like, “No, no, no. I’m going to make this out of tin foil.”
Jeffrey Boedges: Does she use apples? Did you ever do that one?
Rick Kiley: No. She’s kind of like the MacGyver smoker. She’s like, “I need an apple, a pen, give me this thing. We don’t have any apples? Okay. I need a tin can.”
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. She’s very creative.
Rick Kiley: There was a hit movie about that. I forget which one that was.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. In college, I just put a lampshade on my bong all the time and just told that it was a lamp. I didn’t try to tell them it was art. I’m like, “It’s a lamp.” It didn’t work but…
Brooke Burgstahler: That’s pretty cool actually.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. It worked. Yeah.
Rick Kiley: So, you live in this world and I’m trying to find a point to relate here but Jeff and I, we run an experiential marketing agency. We work a lot in the alcohol beverage industry and sometimes I tell people what I do for a living. They’re like, “Well, I don’t get it. What is that?” And it’s not quite like, “I’m a lawyer. I’m a doctor. I’m a firefighter.” So, I’m curious, when people ask you what you do for a living, do you say, “I’m a cannabis authenticator?”
Jeffrey Boedges: What do your parents say? That’s what I want to know. My parents walk around telling everybody I’m in advertising and I’m like, “I’m not in advertising.” But they don’t get it.
Brooke Burgstahler: My mom makes such a big deal out of anything I do at this point. It’s so adorable. She has a Twitter with about 40 followers, I think, and anytime I make content, she’s like, “Can I post it on my Twitter? Can I share it?” I’m like, “Yeah. Thank you for thinking you’re moving the needle in some way.” Sorry if you listen to this, mom. I appreciate you. I’m a multi-hyphenate. I’m a millennial. We wear a lot of hats. Fortunately, I look good in hats. So, I’m not afraid to add another descriptor to my business card but at this point to distill what do I do, a cannabis advocate, a creator, and comedian. Just keeping it CCC so it’s easy.
Rick Kiley: Cool. All right. And a fourth C so it’d be good. So, then take us through a day in the life of a cannabis creator. What is an average day like for you?
Brooke Burgstahler: Right on. So, I have my hands in a lot of honey pots, pun intended, and one of my main focuses right now is Marijuana Morning News, which is a show that I create for BigMike and Advanced Nutrients. And so, my week kind of pans out. Every week I’m scouring, finding inspiration for new stories to write, writing these short-form video scripts, shooting right here on this green screen in my second bedroom. My boyfriend is my director and editor.
Rick Kiley: Nice.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. That’s kind of the production flow. And then in addition to that, I’m also always working on Budding Mind, which is my cannabis wellness platform that largely exists in the digital realm. It is primarily an Instagram community, and just trying to source information, distill it into digestible, entertaining, and engaging forms and blasting it back out into the ethers and hoping that someone’s watching and appreciate it.
Rick Kiley: Well, some people are obviously watching.
Brooke Burgstahler: If only my mom.
Rick Kiley: Your mom’s definitely getting the word out but I think there are some others there as well. And it should be noted for those of you because you’re listening, you can’t notice that she actually does have a microphone that’s bigger than either Jeff or mine. So, she’s got a really fancy microphone.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Bigger than both of them put together.
Brooke Burgstahler: I wasn’t going to say anything.
Rick Kiley: No. That’s fine. So, I was reading up about you doing some research. Your bio had a phrase that I really liked. You said you’re a specialist in high-quality educational entertaining content that you call edutainment. So, that term edutainment is something that we have used regularly when we are creating branded entertainment. You know, we’re trying to create events that bring people together that maybe demystify products or categories or whatever. We’re trying to entertain and educate at the same time. So, seeing as you seem to know the space and you know the world of cannabis, I’m just curious, what do you think in the world of cannabis is part of the successful recipe for a good quality piece of edutainment? Like what do you look for?
Brooke Burgstahler: Well, I think particularly a lot of the work that I do with Marijuana Morning News and in the regular creation of cannabis content, it’s like who does the average person who doesn’t smoke weed every day have the foundation for understanding this information? Who is this person that we’re all trying to address? And in the grand scheme of things, the average person who isn’t consuming cannabis, they might not be so interested if they don’t – it’s like yoga, I equate cannabis edutainment to yoga. People are intimidated to enter into this space because they see it’s helping so many people. It’s healing so many people. Could it do that for me? But I don’t feel comfortable. I don’t feel invited into this space. So, I think edutainment, having that entertaining aspect of informational content invites more people and makes people feel welcome. Maybe if terms like cannabinoids and terpenes go over their head, when you can spin things in a playful manner, they’ll at least feel intrigued to maybe return to find out a little bit more. Yeah. I think there’s a necessity in cannabis education for things to be really welcoming. And it’s weed, right? So, there is so much serious subject matter that is worthy of exploration but at the same time, it doesn’t all have to be grim and this like battle uphill. Like, there’s so much beauty and bliss and so much fun in this industry and in this plant. So, that should all be celebrated and acknowledged and shared.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Do you think it causes anxiety with people? I mean, that’s kind of what we’ve focused on with a lot of our brands and categories that we’ve worked on over the years is that if somebody isn’t familiar with it, they’re worried they’re going to do it wrong. And as a recent adherent to yoga as well, like I can remember like I mean, “Sh*t, I got to go in and these people are super strong and flexible and I’m not,” so there is an intimidation factor. You get nervous and you don’t want to do it wrong. You don’t want to look silly in front of other people. Do you feel like that’s a big part of what you see with cannabis culture right now?
Brooke Burgstahler: I definitely think that that’s an aspect that some people there’s, yeah, there’s the intimidation factor and that intimidation without like the proper community and support can lead someone to just never trying, just never getting there. So, yeah, I don’t want anyone to feel that way. There are so many different, and also, it should be acknowledged that cannabis might not be for everyone. There’s a lot of greenwashing when it comes to cannabis content as well. Everything is perfect and peachy, and that’s simply not the case because there is no one prescription for all human beings everywhere. I would like to believe that cannabis comes pretty freaking close but the reality is that it might not jive with some people but that curiosity is something that deserves to be nurtured in all people.
Rick Kiley: Got it. It’s good.
Jeffrey Boedges: I like the term greenwashing. Maybe I’m the only one who’s not heard that before. Rick, remember when you’ve come it up against?
Rick Kiley: I wash my greens when I’m making salads mostly.
Brooke Burgstahler: Good for you.
Rick Kiley: That’s what I do.
Jeffrey Boedges: You get one of those things that spins the lemons?
Rick Kiley: No, no, no, no, no, no, I don’t.
Jeffrey Boedges: Old school?
Rick Kiley: Unfortunately, yeah. Just a colander rinse and sometimes I get a towel if I have to.
Jeffrey Boedges: That’s not enough to get you through the holidays.
Brooke Burgstahler: I did not come up with that term. Greenwashing is like a term used in like sustainable marketing. Like when Coca-Cola is like, “Oh, we’re using all real sugar now. It’s healthy.” It’s greenwashing. I’ve started to take that term into the cannabis space because it’s very relevant.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. No, that’s good.
Jeffrey Boedges: Cool.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. Take it, Soho Experiential. Run with it.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. We just trademarked it. So, anyone? Who else wants to add?
Rick Kiley: Good luck. We make five cents now every time you say it. It’s awesome. So, let’s talk about the Marijuana Morning News. How did this gig come about? How did you land that? Was it straight from Snoop Dogg to there? Or what was the track?
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh, my goddess, well, when it comes to cannabis content creation there’s no exactly going online to look for these jobs. It’s not as simple as that. It’s a lot of creating these opportunities.
Rick Kiley: Not on Indeed? You don’t have that? No? Shout out to Indeed if you want to sponsor this podcast, we understand.
Brooke Burgstahler: Please, Indeed. Money well spent. Yeah. I actually met BigMike through a traditional casting process for a cannabis business reality show that we shot about two years ago called Next Marijuana Millionaire. Sorry. I’m from Buffalo, New York. It comes out.
Jeffrey Boedges: Oh no. Yeah.
Brooke Burgstahler: I should have started off with that.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. No, we have one in-house, the biggest one.
Brooke Burgstahler: Podcast is over. So, yeah, I shot this reality show, Next Marijuana Millionaire, with their team and BigMike has a really strong mission to make cannabis an everyday and healing, and acceptable part of humanity. And so, offered me this opportunity to create edutaining content for not just his audience, but ideally for the broader spectrum of human beings as well. So, yeah, and it just so happened that they were like, “We want to make a show,” and I was like, “I can write it, I can shoot it, I can edit it, I can host it. I’ll figure it out. Don’t worry about it.” I’ll download the software. I’ll buy the mic. Don’t worry.
Rick Kiley: Are you sure you don’t work for an agency? Because that’s like, “Yeah. We do that. Of course.”
Brooke Burgstahler: Exactly. Say yes and google it later. So, yeah, I’ve been working on the show for about a year now and it’s certainly been a learning process. It’s really empowering to feel like I can create a full package of content, all the nuts and bolts beginning to end, and make something quality.
Rick Kiley: No, it’s cool. I mean, I watched a few of the episodes. They’re nice. They’re quick. I mean, this is a personal thing but I love the idea of providing scientific answers to questions that people maybe have never thought to ask out loud but I love the one on why do I get cotton mouth? Like, that’s something I’ve wondered about but I actually never thought to go research it probably because every time I had it, I was watching Laser Floyd or something like that.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. It makes the Oreos go down easier. It’s what I always thought.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. So, I’m just like I’m wondering, is this the type of education that is ultimately the goal sort of just demystifying these little like snippets? I’m wondering if you can kind of share about like the goal, the programming, and how you’re trying to reach it.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah, for sure. There are plenty of cannabis media outlets and plenty of news publications that support cannabis content but in the video form. That’s my specialty. So, it’s kind of just bringing all of that into a new medium. And particularly because we do primarily exist on Instagram, really infiltrating into that audience and quick little snippets of cannabis information that ideally everyone will grab just one nugget from the two minutes of work that we put forth. So, yeah, the purpose is just to share information and to ideally build a community of curious cannabis consumers and to hold this industry accountable for right information. I’m not an expert. I’m really, I like to research and I like to read and I like to share but taking the information from the experts…
Jeffrey Boedges: Careful. You’re going to get social media a bad name if you’re fact-checking and things like that.
Brooke Burgstahler: But to take the information of the experts, the farmers, the manufacturers, etcetera, these people who typically might not be prime for the camera to take their information and wisdom and give it out.
Rick Kiley: Right. I’m curious because sometimes we’ve heard from other companies that putting content that’s cannabis-related online sometimes it gets taken down. Sometimes accounts get canceled. Has that happened to you? I’m wondering if you could maybe talk about that a little bit if you have some personal experience.
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh, my lord. Well, yes, certainly. Fortunately, my Budding Mind account hasn’t ever been taken down but I know plenty of people. Just my friend last week, she had – you guys are in marketing so you can appreciate it. She had 10,000 organic followers that she built for her cannabis brand. That’s a digital store. So, everything, all of her sales come from the internet. All of them basically stem from this audience she built on Instagram and without any explanation, her account just got shut down. She only sells CBD-based products. She can ship everywhere in the US because what she is doing is legal. But unfortunately, Zuckerberg is a cuck and…
Jeffrey Boedges: When you say cuck, do you mean like a cocky guy like really confident? Or do you mean like…
Rick Kiley: I think it’s C-U-C-K.
Brooke Burgstahler: Cuck. C-U, yes, C-U-C-K.
Jeffrey Boedges: Oh wow. I thought you said something…
Rick Kiley: One who cuckolds?
Brooke Burgstahler: Precisely.
Jeffrey Boedges: To cuckold. Yeah.
Brooke Burgstahler: So, both of your eyes just went very wide.
Jeffrey Boedges: No. You’re just the first person that ever come out and really just lay into him on the show which is it’s fine. We’re all about keeping it real.
Brooke Burgstahler: It’s disappointing that you could be doing some honest work in the world and be punished for it and particularly I would say on TikTok. TikTok is a very interesting platform where you very, very strict, far more strict than any other platform I’ve engaged with. I haven’t successfully been able to upload.
Jeffrey Boedges: It’s so popular with kids like my sons love it.
Brooke Burgstahler: I know. You can’t use the word cannabis or marijuana. Well, I mean, I guess if your sons are on it, maybe that’s for the better but yet there are girls that are wearing like very tiny clothing and like bouncing around doing choreography, and that’s allowed. So, it’s a weird world.
Jeffrey Boedges: Well, it is a weird world. I mean, if you look at like Rated Rs on movies forever, you could have the most incredible violence ever, and you would get a PG rating. You put a naked breast on there, it’s like, “Oh, that’s an R rating.” So, it’s always been inconsistent and it seems to be the moral conscience seems to be sort of all over the compass, if you will, and really no one’s providing any kind of consistency. I think that my personal opinion is that will change. I think you’re going to see a lot more, well, government regulation on what’s cool and what isn’t cool online. I just think it’s past due frankly, but well, hopefully, that will…
Rick Kiley: I’m sure everyone would know how to conform if there were clarity and I think that’s got to be the most frustrating thing like not knowing is this right.
Jeffrey Boedges: Well, I do wonder a question for you, Brooke, is do you feel like I feel like if you weren’t selling, you can kind of say what you want on social media. I feel like the ones that are really getting taken down are the ones that actually have brands that are being sold. That’s all I’ve heard and I’m just curious if you’ve heard of anyone like in your space, which I would consider in the information and entertainment space, have you seen anything in the cannabis world being taken down for that just for talking about it?
Brooke Burgstahler: Just information-wise, no, not so much. The closest thing again is my friend who has The Flower Pot LA that she was just selling CBD products and with candles and things like that. Honestly, it’s just like the cutest, most non-threatening.
Jeffrey Boedges: Well, what was the name of that company? We can tell everybody to go look it up.
Brooke Burgstahler: There we go. The Flower Pot LA.
Jeffrey Boedges: There we go. Check it out.
Brooke Burgstahler: Instagram, she got it back. She got one back, TheFlowerPot.co. There you go, everyone. Give a flower.
Rick Kiley: Sweet. I love sharing the love.
Brooke Burgstahler: Give it a flower. Give it a follow.
Rick Kiley: You can do both. I also think you should be thinking about some cannabis choreography on TikTok. I don’t know what that looks like but you know.
Jeffrey Boedges: I have some ideas. Yeah, like a flower dance but it’s a bud dance instead. You know, like a fan dance.
Brooke Burgstahler: Wow.
Jeffrey Boedges: Sorry. I think I may have just crossed the line. I think we’re going to get shut down.
Brooke Burgstahler: I know what you’re doing with the rest of your day.
Jeffrey Boedges: Exactly. I’m not watching. I’m performing.
Brooke Burgstahler: It’s in your blood.
Jeffrey Boedges: That’s what I do.
Rick Kiley: So, well, let’s keep it moving then.
Jeffrey Boedges: Just to ask a quick question about your community because it’s big. I’m just kind of curious. Is there a typical listener for you or a typical watcher for you? Or is it all over the board?
Brooke Burgstahler: Well, when it comes to like BigMike’s platform, BigMike has a huge reach of all different kinds of people from all around the world. Advanced Nutrients tends to really be the experts, the growers, the cultivators, people in that space, and then when it comes to my own personal brands with Budding Mind, I’m the softer side of cannabis. So, my typical demographic is like women, 18 to 40 in that range that have a general interest in things beyond cannabis in the wellness sphere, as well. So, yeah, but that being said, I guess that’s an interesting look at the scope of the reach is everyone.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. That’s kind of what I was…
Brooke Burgstahler: Because everyone smokes weed, right?
Jeffrey Boedges: Well, absolutely, but I think Rick and I, we have brought it up on a couple of our podcasts recently where I’m just wondering, it still feels like male-dominated. It feels like a male-dominated industry right now and I feel like there’s a lot of from the imagery that’s out there, whether it’s legacy and imagery or whether it’s newfound imagery, I still find a ton of femininity. I can’t even talk today. Yeah. I feel like it’s a huge underserved market right now and so that’s why I was asking if you were sort of leaning into that intentionally.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yes. For my own personal stuff, absolutely, for that exact reason because growing up, the imagery that I was shown, getting used to what cannabis is was like High Times, hip hop culture, typically very masculine, bros wearing flat brim hats with gauge ears like ripping bongs and like that’s not my speed. Like a rose petal hand-rolled joint with a little bit of lavender sprinkled in there like that’s my vibe. I think a lot of women who might have perceived cannabis to be like a little bit grungy or a little bit gross when you introduce them to this whole other, the softer side really, that’s what I want to lean into and, yeah, introduce people to.
Jeffrey Boedges: Right. But you’re still in the flower. I like that because it seems like a lot of women are gravitating more towards edibles and, yeah, that might not…
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. Vape pens and things.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. I’m a flower girl through and through. We actually just harvested, very off schedule. We grew cannabis in our backyard this year. It was really fun.
Jeffrey Boedges: Which is legal, folks.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yes. Six plants in California.
Rick Kiley: Nice. That’s really cool. What else is in your garden?
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh, my goodness. So, I have to say…
Jeffrey Boedges: Lavender, I think.
Brooke Burgstahler: We do have lavender. We have rosemary. We have tons of succulents. Honestly, our backyard is a wonderland. My boyfriend takes care of the outdoor plants. I take care of the indoor plants. The indoor ones are struggling a little bit more. These ferns are hard to keep alive.
Rick Kiley: Now, bees love lavender. Do they like cannabis plants? I’m curious.
Brooke Burgstahler: So, that’s a really interesting thing. Hopefully, I won’t fudge this up but hemp plants and cannabis plants during the off-season, when flowers are no longer blooming and there’s a lot of bee populations that are looking for nectar, they will gravitate toward hemp plants and they will soak up whatever’s there. It doesn’t get them high. I don’t think the cannabinoids like enter into their honey or anything like that but, yeah.
Jeffrey Boedges: It’s too bad they don’t.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. I was just thinking about. I was like…
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. These are the best biscuits I’ve ever had, man. Me needs more of that honey.
Rick Kiley: CBD Honey, you know, cannabis honey.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. They need to get to work a little harder.
Rick Kiley: Oh my gosh, that would be lovely.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. They do. They definitely do have a relationship.
Rick Kiley: Cool. All right. One thing that we talked about a lot and it’s partly because in our business this idea comes up that we’re trying to demystify things about products, about categories that are hard to understand. So, we work a lot in scotch whiskey and wine. You go to a restaurant. You’re presented with a wine list. There are 500 wines. I don’t know how to choose. How do you make an informed choice? And a lot of that approach by demystifying things helps create advocacy and something we do a lot. So, I’m willing to bet that you come across a lot of myths like Indicum makes you sleepy, Sativa wakes you up, and I am wondering if there are any maybe recently popular or fun or just myths that you’ve come across that have needed to be debunked and give you the Florida sort of share and debunk them here. I always loved hearing myths.
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh, cool. Well, one thing that is very interesting to me, I wouldn’t necessarily call it a myth worth debunking but something that deserves further investigation that I’m very excited for more research and answers about is people using cannabis for sleep. We’re often told that like baseline, you can’t sleep, take an edible, smoke weed, that’ll make you go to bed. It often does work for people. It often does help people relax and find some deep rest but when people have PTSD, smoke cannabis before sleep, it can be very beneficial. They’re able to get a full night’s rest because they are lacking REM cycles. Cannabis will often repress your REM cycles, your REM sleep, which is obviously your most deep periods of rest in a night and it’s actually critical for your cognitive and immune functioning. So, when people smoke cannabis frequently before bed, you get like REM build-up. Your body is like just waiting to have its REM sleep finally. That’s why when you smoke weed before bed, you don’t really dream, and then when you stop smoking weed before bed, you’ll have like a night of like, “Whoa, trippy, trippy dreamscapes,” and that’s called REM rebound because, again, your body was just like waiting because it literally needs to have this experience.
So, people who have nightmares, that’s a good thing to not have dreams. They can actually go to bed. People who don’t necessarily have nightmares, it might not be the most beneficial thing for them to be smoking weed to go to bed. And that may be limited particularly to THC. There might be other cannabinoids that don’t necessarily repress REM like CBN, CBG, things like that. I don’t know the exacts about those particular medicines, those options, but that’s something that I really do think is interesting. And that’s again, with the greenwashing like this is your sleepy time edible. Take it before bed. It’s going to fix all your problems. It might help in the short-term but what are the long-term effects of this?
Rick Kiley: That’s interesting. It made me think or like wonder there’s all these like cinematic images of like Vietnam veterans then using cannabis and smoking pot. And I wonder if there was any sort of relationship to the PTSD that a lot of those soldiers were facing when they came back home and to why they were using it.
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh, yeah. For sure. I mean, that’s exactly why so that they don’t have to relive things in their sleep and wake up screaming. So, that’s great and I totally think that that works for some, but again, it’s the one size does not fit all.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. Interesting. Cool. All right. Well, then let’s change gears here and I’d love to hear about your Budding Mind, which is one of your personal pursuits here. And so, maybe you can tell us what is it, how did it start, how’s it going, where’s it going, all that stuff.
Brooke Burgstahler: Budding Mind, a cannabis and wellness community. All are welcome to reiterate. It is a space for the softer side of cannabis, a landing pad for those who are curious, those who are inclined to use cannabis as a tool for wellness and for healing. Yeah. Our objective is conscious consumers in all aspects. Are you aware of what you’re smoking? Are you aware of what you’re eating? What you’re putting in your body on your body? What kinds of brands you’re supporting? And how does that bleed out into the rest of your human existence? And original cannabis content, we’re on Instagram. I have a blog on a website. I just secured my dot-com yesterday, by the way. It’s really exciting.
Rick Kiley: Nice. Well done.
Jeffrey Boedges: Give it a shoutout.
Brooke Burgstahler: BuddingMind.life right now will be BuddingMind.com in 60 days.
Rick Kiley: Nice.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. Really cool stuff. So, it’s just another platform for my creative expression and, yeah, go check it out.
Rick Kiley: Cool. So, do you have a specific point of view about how cannabis should fit into somebody’s wellness or self-care regimen? Like do you have a specific approach? I imagine it’s not one size fits all but like what’s your like…
Jeffrey Boedges: Recipe.
Rick Kiley: Your guideposts? Sort of almost like your spirit guide like what’s the journey you take people on to get to their wellness regimen?
Brooke Burgstahler: Right on. Well, when it comes to cannabis, I believe it’s just as powerful to pass as it is to puff and I did not coin that. But that’s a really good mantra for, you know, sometimes there’s like social pressures or you feel you’ve got weed in your house so you might as well smoke it. I really want to encourage people to look at their relationship with all things that they’re consuming when it comes to cannabis. Why are you smoking? Are you smoking every day? Are you using cannabis every day? Is this to repress something? Are you not feeling something? Is this a tool or is this a crutch? I think those are really important questions to ask yourself. And there’s a lot of different crutches that we use. And is this helping you to become more productive and to contribute more to the world around you and to society? Or is this taking away and making you internalize things and withdraw more? Cannabis has done both of these things for me, and I think it’s just really important to cultivate awareness in your own usage. And also, what brands are you supporting? Like, I believe that that fits under not just self-wellness, but planetary wellness as well. Who is growing your cannabis? How is it grown? What’s the purpose behind the brand that you’re supporting? Is it funded by Philip Morris?
So, yeah, and beyond that, there’s a lot of different ways that cannabis can be integrated into a healthy lifestyle. It’s not just smoking or eating edibles. It’s not just getting high. There are all the advantages of CBD, of salves to put on your body. I’m a big advocate and supporter of a myriad of different plant medicines and I want people to feel safe to explore how these things work in their own lives and also like really go on that journey with yourself to explore. Because at this point in time, doctors cannot prescribe like here’s the exact ratio of this to this. It’s going to fix your little thing. You have to figure that out for yourself and you really have to like be kind to yourself and patient with yourself and just seek out the best options for you that promote the wellest life for you.
Rick Kiley: Cool. Got it. And so, I did spend some time going through your blog posts on the site, and there’s a very wide array of subjects we’re covering here. So, I saw gift guides, I saw lube, I saw stuff on legislation advancing legality. So, I’m just curious, as you’re thinking about what to put there, how are you arriving at sort of the content that you’re creating? Is it what’s on your mind, the news you’re digesting? And this is interesting, you’re putting out there. Are people reaching out to you saying, “This is what I want to hear about. Can you help me with this?” How are you deciding what’s going there?
Brooke Burgstahler: A combination of a lot of different things, things that interest me, things that I think interest other people. I’m particularly drawn to how cannabis has, how it exists in other cultures and other countries, those kinds of things, and also spotlighting people in the cannabis space that I think are doing freaking really unique work. For instance, Jessica Gonzalez of Mommy Jane. She is a canna mom and she has built a really beautiful, and just like heartwarming cannabis community where her whole goal is to not shame moms for smoking weed and she does it with such sweetness. Yeah. I want to use my platform to help people build up their own platforms in that way. So, yeah, it’s a combination, just drawing from the world around me and, fortunately, if I have a question regarding cannabis like how does it affect your sperm, if I go down the rabbit hole of information and studies on the internet, I can generally come up with some nuggets of answers. Maybe not everything is so clear-cut.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. When I think about curating content, I always kind of feel like the people who do it really well are the ones that actually – if it seems interesting to them, then that’ll probably be interesting to other people. You know, it’s really kind of the art thing. I think there are artists out there who say, “Oh, I’m going to try to create something that I think will be interesting to them.” But really the best artists are the ones who like, “I’m doing what I want,” and then they’re able to kind of find their audience that way. You strike me more as the latter because like you come up with some interesting topics. We definitely have not talked about sperm on the show. So, I think you’re the first person in fact to say that word on the show, which is great. Yeah.
Brooke Burgstahler: Look at me, a lot of firsts.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. We are breaking new ground here today.
Brooke Burgstahler: Cannabis does reduce your sperm count, by the way. That’s what studies are saying. It could be a form of natural birth control.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah, for sure.
Brooke Burgstahler: Be all good to it.
Jeffrey Boedges: No wonder my wife keeps buying me joints.
Rick Kiley: Wow. I kind of forgot that other countries exist in this lockdown. So, I’m just like hearing about that’s a place I haven’t even thought about in a while other than we have this idea of like what Amsterdam cannabis culture I think is like that has a historical like ethos synonymous to it but I do recall seeing like, what’s it like in Japan? And what’s it like in these other countries? Those are cool topics and I bet you there’s a big audience for that.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. Lots happening all around the world.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. That’s cool. All right. Jeff’s going to be mad if we don’t talk about yoga because he’s been a COVID lockdown yoga-practicing junkie.
Brooke Burgstahler: Heck, yeah. Tell me about it.
Jeffrey Boedges: Oh, I mean, it was always something that like you kind of nailed it earlier that I was curious in but was intimidated by. And also, I didn’t have a lot of healthy outlets. I mean, I work out but it’s still not about relaxation. It’s not about breathing. It’s not about being present. It’s not about any of those things. You know, my idea of a workout was loud rock music or loud music in general and then trying to get me, “Yeah, I’m getting stoked,” and that really wasn’t doing what I needed it to do. And a friend of mine turned me on to it and she’s just like, I remember I said something about being stressed out and thinking maybe I should do something kind of radical. She’s like, “No. You’re going to do yoga.” But I kind of needed that. I needed that person to make it safe for me. And she did a marvelous job with that. She taught me, give me privates for the first beginning until I at least felt like I wouldn’t go in and embarrass myself. Yeah, it’s been amazing. Yeah, I recommend it to a lot of people now. And I think that people who do yoga tend to recommend it a lot and I’m not 100% sure how I feel about that because it can be a little greenwashing yoga because you’re like, “Oh, it’s good for everything. Oh, you have headaches, it’s good for that. Oh, your dog barks at the night, do yoga.” You know, people tend to overprescribe it for whatever ails you.
Rick Kiley: But that’s an advanced yoga move, downward facing dog barks in the night. That’s a tough one.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. That’s level 3.
Rick Kiley: It’s a good breath control as well as an inversion.
Jeffrey Boedges: You got to go to India to learn it.
Rick Kiley: Well, Brooke, how does your world of cannabis and yoga intersect? Because I imagine there must be quite an intersection there.
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh, yeah. Well, I started as a cannabis user, found yoga later in life, and those things just naturally intertwined particularly in my own home practice. I was no stranger to smoking a joint in my car and then walking into a studio until a teacher once told me like, “You smell particularly herbal.” I was like, “Okay. You’re picking up on this. Amazing.” I just wanted to be in a corner by myself unnoticed. It’s certainly not a performance-enhancing drug. Sometimes it can make my practice a little bit sloppier but sometimes that’s what I need and sometimes it can totally ground me down and like I sink my feet into the floor deeper than I ever knew. So, always depends on the day but cannabis helps me to, I keep using this word, but it really does help me to soften. And there’s such a perfect marriage for that in yoga and just taking time to yourself, time for your body, and just to check in with all the particles that you are made of. Cannabis lets you do that a little quicker, a little easier. So, when I’m on my yoga mat and I’m a little bit high, I find that I can drop in faster. Yeah. It’s like my favorite thing is to do it during yoga, to be honest.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. That’s better than goat yoga, stoned yoga.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. I haven’t tried goat yet but I do have a friend, Hannah Mason, who owns a cannabis yoga studio called Lit Yoga. And I did a, I mean, an absolutely beautiful experience with her yoga studio. First, you start off with a tea ceremony and you’re sharing joints. All of this is probably a no-go now. And then you would have a yoga class where people who maybe weren’t that familiar with yoga or people who weren’t that familiar with cannabis would have a safe space to like, “Oh, no, I’m feeling a lot of things. Great. I have a guide here to help me get through whatever is coming up,” because sometimes things come up that are unexpected when we’re under the influence. But anyways, yeah, I did a yoga teacher training with her as well. She somehow married the intelligence of the chakras with different cannabis strains, that it all made sense in the moment. But one thing that is also really interesting and talking about other countries, in India, sadhus like the wandering holy men, the monks of India, the yogis of India, there are sects of them that just smoke weed all day and do yoga and meditate because they believe that that’s what God did, and by practicing yoga and meditation and being high, they have easier access to God. So, there’s something there.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. It makes a lot of sense. I haven’t believed it or not as a regular user of cannabis and also a regular practicer of yoga, I haven’t actually married to yet. It came up in a conversation not long ago on this show, but I’m thinking about trying it and giving it a shot. But it does make sense because like I can’t really see myself going to a concert without prepping the field, so to speak. You know what I’m saying? Because you can’t. It’s hard. You can go to a show and you might feel like dancing but you definitely going to feel like dancing if you’ve had a joint beforehand, and I can just see how it does open the mind to sort of, I think, as you say, put it to get deeper. So, I think it’s a really interesting thought and now I’m like, “Okay. Maybe tonight.”
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. Give it a try.
Jeffrey Boedges: Maybe tonight.
Brooke Burgstahler: I want to hear a full report back of how that goes.
Jeffrey Boedges: All right. I’ll be on your podcast.
Rick Kiley: Just make sure you have a couple of bags of Doritos for when you’re done or something.
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh, no.
Rick Kiley: Now, I always get hungry.
Brooke Burgstahler: Celery and peanut butter.
Jeffrey Boedges: I’ve been doing carrots.
Rick Kiley: Celery and peanut butter.
Brooke Burgstahler: Love carrots. Oh, love carrots.
Jeffrey Boedges: Wait, what?
Rick Kiley: We’ve lost it. All right. We’re getting close to the end here but I did want to ask one thing because this is something I always find challenging. You’re someone who’s like developing your own personal brand yet you’re also working for others. And I’m curious as to is that challenging for you? I feel like I might be dating myself. I feel like I’m Gen-Xer, I’m in my 40s like just the way that I’ve learned to live my life, I and my agency are kind of like the same identity in a lot of ways. I’m curious if that’s presented challenges for you in sort of how you balanced like this personal brand and professional working for another brand?
Brooke Burgstahler: I would say that, yeah, there are definitely challenges just when it comes to time. But in talking about the variety of audiences that are reached through these different platforms, I would say that people who are drawn to what I am offering personally are typically a little bit different than like the Marijuana Morning News audience and so that enables me to explore some subject matter that might not be fit. When it comes to like the world of wellness and like woo-woo, that really isn’t for everyone. So, in a lot of the content that I’m creating for other brands, that is meant to reach a broader spectrum of people on broader interests, things that are a bit more mainstream. And then when it comes to me, I feel like I can be a little more nuanced, a little more niche, and talk about mushrooms.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. All right. That’s cool.
Brooke Burgstahler: But, yes, it is difficult and really, it comes down to time and where is this idea going to live? Is it going to be for someone else? Or will I keep this idea for me? Or can it be explored in two different directions?
Rick Kiley: Yeah. I had thought there might have been some synergy and crossover like the content that you’re sharing does that, by the way, you’re answering it sounds like that doesn’t happen as much as perhaps I’m thinking.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yes and no. It just depends like just…
Jeffrey Boedges: She’s a multi-hyphenate, dude. She’s just that age. They don’t think about that stuff.
Rick Kiley: You know, I just thought that she would be a little like, “Oh, I use this content here and I can take… and I’m doing this thing with it now.”
Brooke Burgstahler: Sometimes, but like I don’t think Budding Mind audience wants to hear about like what’s going on in the NBA with cannabis. You know, but BigMike’s audience is like, “Oh, hell yeah. Sports. Let’s do this.”
Rick Kiley: Cool. Yeah, I get it. All right. Cool. So, is there anything else you’re working on that you want to tease out here? Is Budding Minds taking all of your focus?
Jeffrey Boedges: There’s got to be a book in the works someplace here, Brooke.
Rick Kiley: Something like that.
Brooke Burgstahler: Oh, my goddess, I would love to write a book.
Rick Kiley: Travel book. Cannabis travel guide. That’s where my mind is at.
Brooke Burgstahler: Are we ready for Urban Outfitters distribution or what? That’s where I imagined it.
Jeffrey Boedges: We will help you underwrite this.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. I think that’s a cool idea. That’s the first thing that came to my mind when you were…
Brooke Burgstahler: That’s great. Except by the time of publication, you’d be like, “Oh, crap, things changed in France.”
Rick Kiley: Nothing ever changes in France.
Jeffrey Boedges: Exactly.
Brooke Burgstahler: Touché. Yeah. Thank you for asking. It’s puppy lockdown podcast, baby. I have a podcast that I am beginning to record this week. Very exciting stuff and so that will be available for listening on all the platforms and I hope to have a deeper conversation with you guys on there someday as well.
Rick Kiley: We would love it. That would be great.
Jeffrey Boedges: I’ll bring my stone yoga stories in tow.
Rick Kiley: Nice.
Brooke Burgstahler: Thank you. Yes. That would be incredible. I hope it all goes well for you.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Well, my handstands might not be quite as good, but I think the rest of it…
Brooke Burgstahler: Yeah. Maybe don’t go upside down, day one.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. I’m not going to do that many inversions on my first one. We’ll see how it goes. We’ll work in slow.
Brooke Burgstahler: Yes. Slow sleepy yoga. There you go.
Rick Kiley: Yeah. So, finally, we always end these interviews with the same question. I know you’re actually probably pretty up to speed on what’s going on in the world of cannabis in the US and legalization and the progress that’s being made. Do you have your estimate best guess of when you think cannabis will be federally legal in these great United States of America?
Brooke Burgstahler: This reminds me of like Dave Asprey’s podcast where he’s like, “How old do you think you’re going to be when you die?”
Rick Kiley: I think that question’s a lot more fun.
Brooke Burgstahler: Or how long do you think you’ll live until… Anyways, I’m going to speak it out into the universe. I would say we’re dipping into early 2022. Legislation is always being worked on and drafted. I have great faith in Chuck Schumer and Cory Booker and Ron Wyden right now that they will be able to successfully push forth the legislation that they are currently working on. And, yeah, that we’ll have end of 2021, 2022. I do have the utmost faith.
Rick Kiley: Cool. And if any of those legislators want to come on this show and talk about it, we are all for it.
Brooke Burgstahler: 422 on Cory.
Rick Kiley: Yeah.
Jeffrey Boedges: Yeah. Cory, he’s number one, but Chuck would be really weird. And I like weird. I just would get weird with Chuck Schumer.
Brooke Burgstahler: Go knock on his door.
Jeffrey Boedges: Come on, Chuck. Let’s go. What are you smoking, dude?
Rick Kiley: Cool. So, when people want to learn more about you, where should we tell them to go?
Brooke Burgstahler: Right on. Please find me on Instagram, @BuddingMind. You can also check out BuddingMind.life soon to be .com. Check out my podcast. And for all other things, just talk to me telepathically.
Rick Kiley: Awesome.
Jeffrey Boedges: All right. I love that.
Rick Kiley: All right. I mean, if it works, if you have telepathic vibes, that’s great.
Brooke Burgstahler: Calling it in.
Rick Kiley: Cool.
Brooke Burgstahler: Thank you, Rick. Thank you, Jeff.
Rick Kiley: Brooke, it’s been great talking to you. Thanks so much for joining us today. Cheers.